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Celebration and recognition are powerful forces of motivation, but how can we use them most effectively? In this episode, Alex and Ben talk about several key principles for building an organization where recognition is abundant, wholehearted, and authentic. They also discuss 7 practices you can try out this week to make celebration and recognition a consistent part of your organizational culture.
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Episode Recap:
- What do most leaders get wrong about celebration and recognition?
- What happens when recognition is missing from an organization?
- Celebration should be abundant, wholehearted, and authentic
- The things that get rewarded get repeated
- Your words will never speak as loud as your compensation
- Culture is what you create and what you tolerate
- In vulnerability, leaders go first
- Compliments cost you nothing and can mean so much
- Recognition is like perfume; it’s nice to be around, but drinking it is poison
- There’s a difference between generosity and recognition
- 7 practices for celebration and recognition
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What is Path for Growth?
Path for Growth exists to help impact-driven leaders step into who they were created to be SO THAT others benefit and God is glorified.
So today, we're talking about celebration and recognition. What do most leaders not understand about this topic? That's a good question.
Alex Judd:Just how powerful it actually is. And I think we will most of us at least will mentally or verbally agree with the idea that, oh, recognition and celebration is good, but we don't understand that it's powerful. And what I mean by powerful is like, man, if we understand human motivation and we understand the role of the leader as helping people go from here to there, then what we are often talking about is a conversation about behavior change in service of other people. And, you know, if we get down to base base level, theory of behavior change within human beings, we're talking carrot and stick. So often, though, when we think about the role of leaders, we're thinking about the hard stick of accountability, correction, you know, changing what shouldn't be or what's not right into what's right.
Alex Judd:But so often, if we focus so much on that, we miss out on this entire swath of opportunity and potential that looks like just amplifying the things that are going really, really well, recognizing the things that are going really, really well. And then beyond that, creating a culture where the bottleneck for recognition in the organization isn't just you, but rather you're creating a culture. People like us do things like this where, constantly there's just this evergreen flywheel of people recognizing the behaviors we wanna see repeated. And man, that's when momentum really starts to get generated is when we're not just dwelling on what are the things that are wrong that we want to be right, but rather what are the things that are right that we wanna recognize, celebrate, amplify.
Ben Loy:Is there a time or a story of when you like, this was really driven home for you or there was like an moment where you just looked around the environment you were in and saw this being played out really well?
Alex Judd:I think it applies. It's a book is what I would say. It's not a time or story, but it's a book. And the book is called Oh Great One, and it's a little parable, in which we can look at it and can be like, that's a really simple book. But I mean, it was written by a guy named David Novak, who was the CEO of Yum Brands, which when he came into Yum Brands, that's, KFC KFC, Taco Bell.
Alex Judd:There's a whole host of brands that fall under the Yum Yum Brands umbrella. When he came in at that time, things were, bad and getting worse, and he actually orchestrated a turnaround in the organization. Right? Things not only stopped becoming bad, they actually became really, really good. And and many CEOs, he he now runs a leadership podcast, actually.
Alex Judd:Many CEOs look to him as like a brilliant, brilliant, brilliant leader, really, really sharp. And and I believe it was his first book, his first book that he wrote on leadership. The entire topic he wanted to focus on was the power of recognition because that is what he said. The single thing that he focused on to turn around, that that massive corporate conglomerate was instilling a culture of recognition at every level of the organization. And so for me, I, you know, I was thinking, because I got to interview this guy.
Alex Judd:I I was thinking, man, I'm about to interview one of the top 100 probably most influential CEOs in America. A guy that has not just talked about the work of leading thousands of people, but has done it. And I was expecting it to be incredibly sophisticated. And what I got was actually something really simple. He just did it better than everyone else.
Alex Judd:And that's, I think, when I started to really start to believe, okay, this isn't just something that's good, it's powerful. And when I started to believe that it was powerful, I started to see it everywhere in the leaders that I really admire.
Ben Loy:Okay. Can you paint a picture of what it might look like when this is missing entirely from an organization? And then also, like, what is possible when this is running really well?
Alex Judd:Yeah. I think maybe a good lagging indicator of does recognition and affirmation exist in your organization? Like, are people having fun? Mhmm. Is a good is a is actually a pretty good, way way to look at it.
Alex Judd:And maybe the first way to look at it is, are you having fun? And it's crazy. I can look at our organization. There have been seasons and times where I'm not having fun and the people that I'm working with aren't having fun either by extension. And you can just tell like there's not celebration, there's not recognition.
Alex Judd:We're taking both what we do maybe a little too seriously, but we're also taking ourselves way too seriously. Conversely, whenever celebration and recognition are abundant, wholehearted, and authentic, and I would highlight those three words, abundant, wholehearted, and authentic, authentic being a big one. It's crazy how fun thing be things become. You know, we were just at our in person experience in Austin, Texas, and and it was it it was one of the best things our team has ever done. It was 60 leaders, and the reason why I think I can say that, in an objective way, non boastfully, is some of our customers has told have told me that's the best thing you've ever done.
Alex Judd:So it's like, okay. Awesome. And what was neat is we would finish these long, like, fifteen, sixteen, seventeen hour days, and our team would have a little bit of a powwow at the end of the day, right? 10PM, something like that. And a lot of times we'd just sit around talking about how good things were going and how like these amazing things that were going on and it's I didn't want to go to bed.
Alex Judd:I was like, just want us to keep hanging and neither and clearly neither did y'all. Sometimes I'm gonna be like, we need to go to bed, folks. Right? But but I think, again, you enjoy being around each other. You enjoy affirming each other.
Alex Judd:It's not this thing that you're trying to manufacture. You're just there's a there's a heart of celebration and abundance in the organization when this is going on well. Yeah. I guess is there anything you wanna say to that? And then we can talk about what it looks like when it's not it's not around.
Ben Loy:Yeah. So you highlighted those three key things. You said it was abundance Wholehearted. Wholehearted and authentic. Can you because in in my mind, some of those things that there's a lot of overlap and maybe the direction that those could go.
Ben Loy:Can you kind of distinguish what those three things are in this context?
Alex Judd:Yeah. I appreciate you for saying in this context. Abundant. It's not being withheld. Right?
Alex Judd:One of the proverbs I'm sure we'll talk on more in this conversation today is, I think it's Proverbs three twenty seven. Do not withhold good from those to whom it is due when it is in your power to act. That's a good proverb. And there are, I know leaders and have actually been counseled to act this way that says, be very reserved with your compliments to your people because you want them to be hungry for your compliments.
Ben Loy:Right. Issues with that.
Alex Judd:Yeah. Yeah. Me too. Right? Now now, the element of truth that's in that that I think is good is we should not be engaging in flattery, which there are personality types that engage in flattery, which is like, I'm just saying stuff to say stuff to make people smile.
Alex Judd:It's not actually true.
Ben Loy:Yeah.
Alex Judd:That's not good leadership at all. But but, you know, what we're really talking about there is flirting with the line between motivation and manipulation. And, you know, I believe we're supposed to operate in abundance, which is when I see something good, I say something good. And I am not at all going to say like, well, I gave them a compliment yesterday, so I need to wait a couple weeks before I give them another one. If it's true, you should say it is what I should is what I would say, but more important what Proverbs would say.
Alex Judd:So so that's abundant. Wholehearted, you know, it should come out of the overflow, of your heart. Right? Guard your heart above all else, for out of it flows the wellspring of life. Out of the core of your being, is the Hebrew word, flows everything you do.
Alex Judd:And so what we want to do is have a heart, a core, a will that wants what's best for others and for our words, our celebration, our recognition, and even our habits that we're going to talk about here in just a bit to flow out of that place. And then authentic, we kind of hit on this already, but we're not talking about flattery here. We're not talking about just niceties to be nice, right? What we're talking about is telling the truth as you see it. And another thing with that too that I constantly have to monitor myself on, and I think there's personality types that are like mine that have to monitor themselves on, is like you actually decrease the power of genuine recognition whenever you exaggerate.
Alex Judd:Whenever you say, you are just the best speaker that I've ever met ever. Right? It's like, in some ways, we can look at that and say that's a really good that's a really good compliment. And if it's true, then maybe you should say that. You you probably should say that.
Alex Judd:Right? But if it's not true and you're just saying you're you're a really exceptional speaker, I would rather you say, you are such an exceptional speaker and here's three three reasons why than using some broad brush exaggerative statement that people are actually gonna discount because they're like, they're just saying stuff at this point.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Well, I mean, it takes in in many ways, like, in the same way that often it takes trust and within the the compounds of a relationship to receive criticism. Like, you should probably, as a just as an individual in general, hold compliments in the same way. It's like, does this person know me at a level that they're actually able to inform, you know? And that's not to say to completely discount anything anyone ever says to you, but understanding that, like, trust is built through relationship and with relationship comes the impact of your words.
Ben Loy:And so, you don't need to be speaking with, like, these overwhelmingly flattering, like, over the top words to be acknowledging and celebrating people.
Alex Judd:That's right. And and to that point, like, when you say something, make sure you mean it. Do not say things you don't mean. It was so interesting to me. I I was talking to Michelle after our experience.
Alex Judd:Michelle was largely the logistical mastermind behind the experience that we just did in Austin. And it was a if she was the mastermind, then it was a logistical masterpiece. It was pretty remarkable, the number of details that she was able to attend to and execute with excellence. And she made a point of telling me, which the fact that she made a point of telling me this is noteworthy. She shared with me that Brian Miles, who's mentor and friend of mine, he and his wife Shannon, brilliant entrepreneurs that spoke at this experience, he had come up to her on the final day of the experience, and he just paused her for a second, which we're gonna talk about here in just a bit in the actions.
Alex Judd:He paused her and said, hey. Just look at me real quick. And then he said, you murdered this. Which might that that is actually very authentic to the language Brian uses. So but but and then she what she said, though, in recanting this story to me is she said, and I just get the feeling that Brian doesn't just say stuff like that.
Alex Judd:What she's saying there is I actually think that compliment, like, was authentic, and and he said it because he meant
Ben Loy:it. Mhmm.
Alex Judd:And and because of that, it carried a ton of weight for her. And so what we're not gonna say is don't say things that you mean because you wanna be able to, you know, keep them reserved and keep people hungry. Right. What we do wanna say is say things that you really, really, really mean and make sure you mean them whenever you say them.
Ben Loy:So, we have five leadership principles. Let's just jump into the first one. What is it?
Alex Judd:Yeah. So so these kind of inform why it's helpful to think about the topic of celebration and recognition. We'll run through these principles somewhat rapid fire. Number one is the things that get rewarded get repeated. And and so number one, it it shows why we should be engaging in recognition.
Alex Judd:But then number two, be wise about what you recognize because the thing that when you recognize something, especially publicly in your organization, it's literally you waving a flag saying, everyone pay attention. I want all of us to do more of this. And if you're not careful with that, you will reward and recognize things that you don't actually want to occur in an organization. And so if someone, you know, say you have a salesperson that just is getting insane results and you celebrate them without simultaneously paying attention to the fact that they were probably exercising some toxic competitiveness. The way that they got those sales are not exactly aligned with the organization's values, And they basically said the means justify or the ends justify the means, so I'm going to do whatever it takes.
Alex Judd:You are waving a flag telling people do stuff like that, and they will is what's crazy is people are so driven by recognition and affirmation within a culture that people will repeat what you reward. So be very diligent and and deliberate about what what you reward and what you recognize.
Ben Loy:I guess that that's a really good example of when if you're depending on which chair you're sitting in and how much insight you have, like, could be it seems like, oh, we're rewarding this really good thing because they're performing well. Then when you actually look under the hood, the means at which they accomplish that thing, you know, coming into question. Yeah. Do you have any other examples of what that could look like? Like, something that maybe from the outside perspective is like, oh, well, of course, like, of course, we would reward performance, but it was misaligned with the intention.
Alex Judd:I mean, a very practical example that's somewhat related is Right? When you are designing compensation plans, compensation is recognition. Right? It's it's I see what you're doing, and this is what I value it as. Well, I've seen organizations so often say, man, this person is crushing acquisition, but the minute they acquire the customer, the back end service after we acquire the customer sucks, and they don't care at all about the handoff.
Alex Judd:Like, they don't pay attention to the transition, and they're not following up at all to make sure the customer gets served. And it's like, okay. Well, what's their compensation? It's like, well, we're paying them we're we're paying them commission on acquisition strictly. Mhmm.
Alex Judd:Well, there you go. Right? And you could be the loudest leader in the world. And I can say this because I might give you a run for your money. Run pretty loudly.
Alex Judd:You could be the loudest leader in the world, and your words will not speak as loudly as the paycheck that they get twice a month. I guarantee that. And so you are telling them what you value based on what you pay them for. And so it's really helpful to constantly and consistently make sure that your comp plans align with what you actually want to be reproduced in your organization. And don't tell people, hey, I'm gonna pay you for this because this is what's actually valuable.
Alex Judd:But then tell them, hey, but really, I value these things over here. If you value these things over here, find a way to compensate for those things as well. So it's not you talking against the comp plan that you've already established.
Ben Loy:Yeah. So we we've identified what maybe you don't want to explicitly or or only reward. What does rewarding the right things look like?
Alex Judd:Yeah. I I love to shout out and recognize hidden work. Right? I loved it as a leader, you know, and you can see this in compensation packages, but we already talked some about that. But it's like, I often want to recognize here's an example, like Bert or Michelle on our team for the things that they do that most people would call boring.
Alex Judd:Right? And like when you call attention, you say, man, you do boring things so well that no one even knows they're going on. And that's the measure of success is we we never even realize that this process is being executed just because it happens like clockwork. It's almost like a machine does it. And it's because, man, you're you're you're so consistent.
Alex Judd:You're so diligent. You're so repetitive. So, you know, I personally want for myself, but also for our whole team to be consistent, diligent, steadfast, not just extravagant, big, creative, bold. And so I'm gonna recognize those things that are often going to be overlooked because that's something that I wanna see reproduced in our organization. I also wanna call attention not just to people's performance.
Alex Judd:I wanna call attention to their character. Mhmm. Because I wanna constantly remind our people, every time you you as a leader publicly affirm someone, you're making a culture bid. You're saying this is something that I'm hoping all of you pay attention to because this is something that I as a leader value. And people people might not use that language, but they pay attention to it.
Alex Judd:And so, you know, you're basically saying pay attention to this, value this because I value this, and we wanna value people's character, not just their performance. So I often will use the phrase what you did was good, but the way you did it was what really stood out to me because I that's basically me giving a talk to our team at that point on the way we do what we do means everything. Mhmm. Critically important.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Was there anything else you wanted to say on that before we move on?
Alex Judd:You know, I no. I don't think so. Let's go on to number two. So number two is directly related. It's culture is what you create and or what you tolerate.
Alex Judd:Mhmm. And so what we're talking about here is, like, what do you want more of? Well, start by just celebrating, recognizing, and being thankful for that. But then also, what do you want less of? Make sure you're not tolerating that.
Alex Judd:That's less in the realm of celebration and recognition. But also make sure that you're not creating a culture that celebrates and recognizes things that you don't actually want in your organization because that can be that can be really toxic too.
Ben Loy:Mhmm. What do you mean by that?
Alex Judd:Let's use what can be a little bit of a sensitive example. So we live in a time, and we are a company that really values healthy growth. Right? And and we also believe in freedom and responsibility. You can over index on those things, and suddenly we're slapping healthy growth as the bumper sticker to excuse mediocrity.
Alex Judd:And we're saying, oh man, you know, you're doing such a good job of taking off at 2PM and you're doing such a good job of being with your family over the weekend. Meanwhile, your work isn't good, right? And like you're not giving your best. You're not being wholehearted in what you do. And but if we if we are celebrating or if we are endorsing mediocrity, that's not helpful.
Alex Judd:We're essentially tolerating. We're saying that, well, you should, you know, take time off and lower your standards in pursuit of that because that's healthy growth. No. We need to have a proper conception as a team of what healthy growth actually is and what freedom and responsibility actually is. It's another thing that I I have honestly told our team before and I have to remind myself of is freedom and responsibility is one of our core values, right, which means that, you know, we experience uncommon freedom when we take uncommon responsibility.
Alex Judd:If we're not careful, we can make that principle overly simplistic and say freedom equals vacation. Responsibility equals work. Mhmm. And it's like, no. That's not the value.
Alex Judd:Right? The value is, man, when I do good work and I take responsibility for my work, I experience it as freedom. Right? And certainly part of that is I get to go on vacation and things like that. That's great.
Alex Judd:Right? But it's more than just, man, when I do good work, then my payment for that is I get to go on vacation. No. It's man, when I actually take full responsibility of that which has been given to me to influence Steward and be responsible for, then the thing that I experience in all of that is freedom and that's what we really want people to have an experience. And so what we don't want to do is anytime someone goes on vacation and they're off their phone the whole time is to say, man, that is exactly what we're talking about when we say freedom and responsibility.
Alex Judd:That is one manifestation of freedom and responsibility. And especially if they did a really good job documenting what needed to be done and delegating what needed to be done. Awesome. But we need to make sure that we're not creating a culture that just said it's, you know, vacation is the value because that's not the value. If it was, we would just say vacation is one of our core values.
Ben Loy:Yeah. So you have you have both create and tolerate. Right?
Alex Judd:Yeah.
Ben Loy:How does intentionality speak into those two things?
Alex Judd:Yeah. Well, a lot. Right? We often tolerate things that we, subconsciously inherited. Right?
Alex Judd:And we just say, oh, well, that's just the way that it's always been, and so that's the way that it's gonna be. Or we we never took time to ask the question, is this best? Is this best for our people? Is this best for our customers? It's just something that we tolerated.
Alex Judd:The minute we say, you know, we're going to take an active role in creating the culture that we actually want, well, you're getting on offense at that point. You're shifting your leadership weight and your influence from your heels to your toes. And so to answer your question, you're operating with intent at that moment. And so what we're really talking about here is what is the culture, not that I, what is the culture that we want to be a part of? And how do we go about making that happen more and more?
Alex Judd:And I'm just submitting that recognition and affirmation are a huge part of that. Mhmm.
Ben Loy:Let's move on to the the third one, which is invulnerability, leaders go first. Can you share a little bit about why you put that on there?
Alex Judd:For me, one of my love languages is words of affirmation, giving and receiving. Right? I thrive on that. That is not everyone's personality style. It is what I know to be true.
Alex Judd:And for a lot of people, words of affirmation feels very vulnerable because, you know, we teach something called the six stages of relationship and good affirmation and recognition bridges the gap from what I think about you to what I feel about you. And the minute you go to what I feel about you, like, can be really it can be really, really tough for people. And, I I was just having a conversation with someone the other day. They were at our experience. We always close our experience with affirmations.
Alex Judd:It's such a powerful time. And, like, I mean, literally within seventy two hours of being together, we the the room is in tears. It's unbelievable. It's really, really powerful. And and I think necessary for leaders.
Alex Judd:That's why we do it every single time. But someone was telling me, they were like, I had something that I I was just on the edge of my seat wanting to say, but I couldn't bring myself to say it. I couldn't bring myself to stand up and say it. And certainly, in a room full of 60 people where all eyes are on you, that can be really intimidating and really hard. But what I often see is that even if it's not 60 people, even if it's one person, there can be a lot of resistance that we face to sharing people what we think with people what we think about them and telling people what we feel about them.
Alex Judd:It feels vulnerable. And what I know to be true is a lot of times, leaders need to be the last person to speak. Right? In times where it's like ideation or or, you know, talking about what the business is gonna do moving forward or planning or things like that, you know, sharing of opinions, A lot of times in those scenarios, it's really helpful for a leader to be last to speak because they want everyone's thoughts and opinions to get out. In situations that are vulnerable, the leader actually needs to go first.
Ben Loy:Mhmm.
Alex Judd:Right? In situations where you are asking people to give something of themselves, whether it's shout outs or affirmations or telling people how they, you know, express gratitude for the year or something like that, people are gonna sit back until they see someone be the living example of what they want to be or what they aspire to be. And so a lot of times, you you have to give some of yourself first. You have to be vulnerable first. And it feels vulnerable.
Alex Judd:It feels exposed because you're like, we might do this affirmations exercise, and I might speak, and I might give my whole self to this room. And then after that, it might be crickets. And that that is scary and intimidating. It's a good thing you're not doing it for you, though. Right?
Alex Judd:If you are doing it for you, then you're not gonna do it. Right? If you're doing it for because it's the right thing to do and you're doing it for other people, then that will give you the courage to stand up and exercise that vulnerability.
Ben Loy:Mhmm. I mean, I guess you've alluded it alluded to it already talking about showing people how you or telling people how you feel about them. Right? There's a there's a layer of vulnerability there. Can you maybe dive into, yeah, why why does recognition and affirmation feel so vulnerable both for the person giving and sometimes even the person receiving it?
Alex Judd:I would be interested to know your thoughts on this because like like I said, this is the you know, there are other love languages that don't come as naturally to me. This is the one that that, yeah, like, I I I love this. Right? I literally love this, and and it's one of my favorite things to do. So in some ways, I would be theorizing.
Alex Judd:But I guess any time you ask someone to really tell you about how they feel about you, it's like I mean, right? We all know this. Right? The first time I ever told Aspen I love you, the fir the first thing that's coming to my mind is, like, what is she gonna say back right now? Right?
Alex Judd:And I experienced a lot of resistance with, man, like, when am I gonna do this? And do I want to do this? Because what is she gonna say back? And eventually so that's an area where I struggled with it. Right?
Alex Judd:Eventually, it got to the point where I was like, I don't care what she says back. It's not about what she says back to me about me because this is really how I feel about her. Mhmm. And if I can do it in that arena, I can do it in other arenas pretty pretty easily. It's like, I'm gonna give myself and at risk of being rejected, at risk that you might not receive it, at risk that you might not say nice things back, and that's okay Because in some ways, what we're talking about here is this is a gift.
Alex Judd:Right? I am blessing you with this, and you could you know, what I find is people rarely, if ever, reject your affirmation, but, especially if it's wholeheartedly given in abundance with authenticity. But ultimately, the result doesn't really matter if it's the right thing to do. Yeah. Is there anything you would add to that?
Ben Loy:As far as why why is so resistance?
Alex Judd:Like, why do people not do this?
Ben Loy:I I mean, I think I think you already you already spoke to it like that. Yeah. What if it's not received well? What if they don't, yeah. What if it's not received well?
Ben Loy:What if they don't care? What if, you know, what if it's weird? What if it's uncomfortable? What if it's awkward? What if what I say is, like, doesn't resonate?
Ben Loy:Like, I think there's I think there's a lot of, like, I, I, me, me, me in those questions. Yeah. Right? And, and then it then it's just a matter of, yeah, if I guess if you're framing it in a way of like, oh, no, the intention of this is to serve them, that would probably solve, like, most most of the anxiety around something like that.
Alex Judd:And it's hard to give what you haven't received. Yeah. So, you know, that's why I think it's one of the reasons why we do affirmations at the end of our experiences is because a lot of times people, you know, grew up in homes or are now playing the leadership role where no one's asking me how can I encourage this person but everyone's looking to this person for encouragement? Yeah, it's really, I mean, you can't give what you haven't received. You have, but it is like a muscle in that way.
Alex Judd:Mhmm. Right? I just get this feeling and it's one of the visions that motivates our experiences. Like we've got leaders that were in that room that are gonna be, like, the world's most encouraging leaders this week because they just, like, their cup is overflowing, and now they're just looking for opportunities to encourage and affirm the way that they were encouraged and affirmed. And Christmas is such a wonderful time to do that.
Alex Judd:Right? That's when this episode is airing is right in between that critical juncture between Thanksgiving and Christmas. It doesn't have to be a Christmas, but this is a good time to get started. And what's cool about that is, you know, I I always think about it. It's like when you move into a new house, you've got, like, that three week juncture where if you see your neighbor, you should ask what their name is.
Alex Judd:Because if we get six months down the road and you're now asking what their name is, you're like, oh, dead gum it. It's too late. Right? And so so that three week juncture is a critical time to bake the cookies, ask what their name is, meet people, all of that. Take advantage of that time.
Alex Judd:Christmas kind of provides that for our team as it's like, you've got this, like, unique window where it's not gonna totally blind sign people if you suddenly get really warm and affirmative and, like, positive and it's like so if you need that to be like, I'm gonna exercise a little bit of vulnerability, blame it on Christmas. Right? Just say like, tis the season, I guess I caught the bug and I don't wanna be Scrooge. I just wanna say how I feel about y'all real quick.
Ben Loy:Yeah. I think I stole this from you, but I mean, recently
Alex Judd:So it might not might not be a very good thing.
Ben Loy:But, I mean, recently, I in in the last actually, no, this this goes directly back to Path for Growth. July, we had our team experience and we did Sure. Did. You know, it was my first experience of of affirmations and affirmation station and and that whole thing, and and I left that thinking, yeah, like, and I think you had you had said it at some point either there or before of, like, not leaving things left unsaid. And that specifically resonated with me, and it's so simple and easy to remember.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Just, like, not leaving things left unsaid. And so as yeah. I guess over the last few months, as people come to mind, I just that, like, kinda echoes in my in my brain, and I'm I've been a lot more forward with, like, expressing gratitude for people and taking the time to to send that text or that voice memo or or whatever. And and, yeah, it is vulnerable.
Ben Loy:It is and it is sometimes it's unexpected. I mean, sometimes I'm like, yeah, 8AM on a Monday. Here you go, dude. Like, long text, scripture, like, all this stuff. But I'm just like, man, I'm just grateful for you and, like, this is the time that I just felt that and, and, like, I'm gonna do this.
Ben Loy:And in many ways, like, the intention is to build others up, But in the practice of that has been so good and edifying for me because I just feel when I think about the people in my life and I think about the ways that the Lord is using them and, like, their character and how God has designed them for specific passions and gifts and the way that they're using them, like, I leave those moments feeling so inspired. Like, I mean, just overflowing with inspiration for my own life and the lives around me and and that starts with with vulnerability, right? Leading with vulnerability. And and sometimes those messages are met with, like, a reciprocation, which is awesome, but it's not an expectation. Mhmm.
Ben Loy:But, like, in in many ways, not from the spirit of self-service, yeah, it's like gratitude begets gratitude. Like, that vulnerability is a reflection of Or it gives other people a reflection of what could be and hopefully inspires them to continue that pattern forward.
Alex Judd:Yeah. And, you know, don't even think about it just in the context of your company. Right? It's it's like, you know, it's good for everyone if the good things that you see in the world get repeated. And so, like, wouldn't it be a shame if you saw good things going on and you didn't say anything about it?
Alex Judd:Because that's gonna decrease the chance that that person has the motivation and energy to repeat those things. Mhmm. It's like, it does not cost you anything to look at the cashier at the grocery store and say, man, the whole time I've been checking out through this line, you've been smiling. And, like, that's just awesome. Five seconds.
Alex Judd:Right? And, I mean, can change so much. And so just putting on our recognition, like, sunglasses in some ways and saying, like, I'm gonna see and say stuff everywhere that I go is is a really good standard to hold.
Ben Loy:Let's move on to number four. Recognition is like perfume. Yeah. Explain. Yeah.
Alex Judd:I heard someone say this on Carrie Newhof's leadership podcast. He's actually a pastor of one of the fastest growing churches in the country right now, and it's here in Phoenix. It's, is it CCV? Christ Church of the Valley. Yeah.
Alex Judd:Pastor of that church. I think his name is Ashley, which I was like, his name is Ashley. That's kinda cool. I'm down. I haven't met Ashley, but Ashley, you're here in the Valley.
Alex Judd:We'd love to have you on the podcast. So so he said recognition is like perfume. He said, it's nice to be around and it's good to smell, but if you drink it, it's poison and pretty good. Right? It's like, oh, I like the smell of that.
Alex Judd:Some of us, some of us drink recognition, and that is poisonous to our soul. And not only do we do that, we we teach our team to drink recognition. We we make their end all, be all value and worth, you know, and we reinforce their belief that their value and worth comes from the things that they do. And, you're teaching them to drink perfume at that point. You're you're teaching them to drink poison.
Alex Judd:And what's really tough about that is if people get obsessed with the headlines of the best things that they've done, then the critics are gonna crush them. Mhmm. Right? What we really want to be is people that aren't really moved all that much one way or the other by headlines or by critique, but rather we're steady and and these recognitions are nice encouragements for moving forward, but they are not at all statements about our identity. Yeah.
Alex Judd:And so I I just felt like that was worth highlighting here. And before we get into the practical side of this episode is we always need to properly contextualize the way that we receive recognition and the way we extend it.
Ben Loy:How do you fight against or solve for that?
Alex Judd:I mean, be have your identity rooted in something that's immovable, I think, is is the biggest thing that I would say. And then I think this is where it's crucial too. Like, we say, oh, hey. What you did is not who you are. A lot of times when people do things that are wrong, like you made mistakes, things like that, we also need to remind people that when they do good things and all of that, that's not who they are either.
Alex Judd:Mhmm. Right? And so we just need to remind people like, hey, you're not perfect. And and this won't happen every time, but it did happen this time. And I I do wanna call attention to how you did such a good job of this.
Alex Judd:Right? You know, a good example, this is I I already alluded to it. Michelle worked so hard on this past experience and she had she had some late nights last week. Right? Yeah.
Alex Judd:And so, like, me just being quite frankly, hopefully a strong leader, but also a good friend to her is saying like, hey, you're now on this like high high, which is awesome. And it would be really easy for you just to keep that going and just like basically run on adrenaline in the next week. I just said like, I think it would be good for you to take a breather and take a rest, and just recognize, like, you just did all these awesome things and they were awesome, but that's not who you are and that, like, I don't you don't have to be working late nights every night for you to be a valued contributing member of this team. And so let's just hit the reset button now and get back on to some normal rhythms. I think we've got to make sure that we treat people as though their work is not who they are, their work is where they serve, and that they're serving from a good place.
Ben Loy:Yeah. And when you're running a team full of threes on the Enneagram, that's extra enthusiasm.
Alex Judd:Yeah. When you are a three on the Enneagram, yeah, we got a lot of achievers in our business.
Ben Loy:There's two sitting across the table from each other right now and
Alex Judd:we got some more. Olivia, Michelle. Yeah, Exactly. And and Yeah. So, yeah, encouraging.
Alex Judd:You know, it it goes to we we bit off some pretty intense strategic priorities for q four here. Like, myself, you, Olivia, and Michelle, we've got a lot of work that we want to accomplish above and ahead of where we currently are. And and thankfully, you know, when we did our strategic priority meeting, we were all extremely, like, energized by it, game on for it. We we all knew it was a lot of work, but we were game on for it. And I felt like the message that I was supposed to send and share with our team on the back end of defining those strategic priorities was not this, like, hey.
Alex Judd:Let's give it everything we absolutely have and sell ourselves out for these priorities and we're gonna cross this finish line q four. Right? I actually felt like like that is in each of these individuals. They got that message. Right?
Alex Judd:They've got the pep rally. They've got the pep talk. They they each have proven that they're holding an extremely high standard with getting work across the finish line. And so I was like, that's not what I think my role to say is here is my role is to say, hey, remember, Thanksgiving's coming up. Christmas is coming up.
Alex Judd:This is a really critical time for our experience. Like, we are not gonna miss out on being present with the things that matter most to get these things across the finish line, and do not allow the fact that you have to finish your strategic priorities keep you from celebrating the incarnation of Jesus Christ, which is crazy that we need to say that, but we, like, need to say that. And we're very capable of not. And so also just kind of, you know, recognizing, like, that's goes into what you reward will get repeated. If if we reward a sellout mentality to achieve the goal, then we will get more of that, and it will probably reduce tenure on our team because people will burn out and burn up.
Alex Judd:Right? But I guess the final caveat I would give to that is it takes leadership wisdom to know, do these people need a push and a motivational talk, or do they need an encouragement word of grace And which one to offer at the right time Mhmm. I think is really, really it's something that I wouldn't have even known to do five years ago that I know a little bit more about now.
Ben Loy:And I guess in the spirit of recognition, I think you did it really well.
Alex Judd:Good. Well, we'll see.
Ben Loy:No, I mean, it was I know for me personally, it it was a really it was a good, like, speed bump to just be like, oh, yeah, like, we are, like, we are going into this holiday season and, and I and I know me personally, like, I have things going on during this holiday season that are gonna pull me out of town and be busy. And, like, I wanna be present with those people that I'm gonna be with. And it was a good it was a good heart check of like, oh, yeah. Like, this and the New Year is just around the corner and and, yes, we can we can achieve this, but, like, at what cost? Yeah.
Alex Judd:Right? And it's not to say that we're not trying to achieve it. No. We're actively and but what, you know, what I kind of saw in that is I was like, I think me saying this actually might be more inspirational to working hard in the times we need to work hard. Yeah.
Alex Judd:Which is you you wouldn't necessarily think that, and it requires a little bit more trust and faith to say that. But it's why understand this is a critical recognition principle that I don't think we expected to get into is if you're going to recognize well, you need to understand what your people are motivated by. Yep. And that, like, what is driving and motivating them is critical because you could be recognizing with, with things that they don't actually care about that much. And meanwhile, there's all this opportunity to recognize, incentivize with things they actually do care about.
Alex Judd:You're just unaware. So really understanding what motivates people is is really helpful.
Ben Loy:Mhmm. Let's move on to the last one before we we dive into the practical real quick.
Alex Judd:These final two are kinda like warnings in some ways.
Ben Loy:Yes. Yeah. I would I would agree. So the last one is there's a difference between generosity and recognition. Yeah.
Ben Loy:I I mean, even I actually have quest like, questions that yeah. What is the difference between generosity and recognition?
Alex Judd:I actually have questions. Yeah. Yeah. Generosity is, giving without expectation of anything in return, and it's not contingent upon anything either. Right?
Alex Judd:Generosity is selflessly giving of yourself or your resources to other people. So when I give a Christmas bonus to a member of our team and say, hey, I just wanted to give you this $1,000 check because it's Christmas, and I just appreciate who you are, and I just wanted to be generous. What I'm not saying there is, man, you crushed your q four goal, and I just wanted to say Merry Christmas. Those are two very different messages. And and we don't we probably don't have the time.
Alex Judd:And and, honestly, like, I'm I'm this is probably something I'm still working through on my own. Recognition often comes to a degree with expectation. It comes with an expectation of, like, you did something, and and as a result, I wanna say thank you for that. I wanna make sure I'm recognizing that effort. But then also, there there's you recognize with the expectation of a return of things being repeated.
Alex Judd:Generosity, a lot of times things get repeated, but you're you're kinda just putting up your hands and being like, this is a generosity play. Right? And I I just wanna give because I feel compelled to give. And understanding the difference between the two is really, really critical. We had a member of the Path for Growth community recently that his company paid for the funeral expenses of a family's daughter that passed away, I believe, at age 13.
Alex Judd:Yeah. Tragic situation. So sad. Was that recognition or generosity? No one is asking how did this team member perform
Ben Loy:Yeah.
Alex Judd:And and allowing that to influence, should we do this? No. What they said is this is the right thing to do. We feel God is calling us to do this, and so we are going to do this. And that is divorced from any red, yellow, green.
Alex Judd:And that's I think why that's so important is because it helps preserve the beauty of true genuine generosity, and is it it doesn't distort it into something that's manipulation. And so distinguishing between the two of, like, if you're gonna recognize for effort taken and and accomplishments achieved, do that. And I think that that's really good. And then I think there's also spaces to be generous. Just recognize that those are two different things.
Ben Loy:Yeah. And and I
Alex Judd:would say maybe you can recognize generously. Yes.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Yeah. I I do like the, I mean, the distinguishment though, because it also creates separating that language and creating language around it creates intentionality. So it's like, oh, I mean, a leader can step back and go, yeah, where where are the areas that I'm making room and margin for me to just be generous? And then also Mhmm.
Ben Loy:Where are the areas where I am being intentional about recognizing the people that I'm leading in a way that's recognizable and effective and regular. And so I feel like most of my questions with that specifically are more in the practical realm. So, let's just dive into the, you say you have seven practices.
Alex Judd:Yeah. And I think these are really simple. Like, I think it's very practical. And so, hopefully, we're bought into the reality and power of celebration recognition. Now we're just saying, how do we do these things?
Alex Judd:And I honestly think my goal would be choose one of these that you want to do. Some of them are leadership things. Some of them are more personal individual things. Choose one and do that between now and the end of the year and maybe consider creating a habit or rhythm of doing it regularly.
Ben Loy:Mhmm. What's What's the first one?
Alex Judd:Yeah, it's creating space and framework for peer to peer shoutouts. So this can happen two ways. It can be maybe it's a Slack channel that you have or whatever platform you use for, what would it be, async communication, right, where people can post in their shout outs, right, and create that space. But then also, what I would say is the best teams that I know, I've been a part of, we do this on our team, We work with many companies that do this in their in their, like, team communication meetings. So they've got the full team there.
Alex Judd:They've got their department leads there or things like that. They just create space. Maybe it's fifteen minutes for, like, what shout outs do people have? One of the best examples I've seen in this is with a team, of about 30 I believe it's about 35 people now that we work with in Austin, Texas, Five Stone Tax. And JP, is the owner of Five Stone Tax, and they do a team meeting.
Alex Judd:I believe it's once a month. And in that team meeting, they just open it up for shout outs. And what's so cool is they've created the culture where people are showing up to that meeting ready with things to say. And I mean, people are clapping, people are laughing, and people leave that meeting smiling. Right?
Alex Judd:And so in some ways, one of the ways we teach accountability is the team holds the team accountable, not the leader. It's not the leader that holds the team accountable. It's the team holds the team accountable. The same is true with the recognition. The leader does not recognize the team.
Alex Judd:The team recognizes the team. So creating the environment where people can do that across the organizations and where it's like, hey, this is now when we do that. You're all you're doing is providing the speed bump so that people take time to say, what was good and right and true that happened that I saw recently, and how do I make sure someone hears about that?
Ben Loy:The the second one, is write handwritten notes, and I actually experienced this from you pretty recently, and it's one of my personal favorites. But Well, good to know. Shed some light in on that.
Alex Judd:Yeah. Well, I I I've got a lot of people that I could speak to kind of being inspirations in this regard, but probably the one that stands out as the most ruthlessly consistent is Tracy Pinais. Tracy is one of our one on one coaching clients. She, that woman, you do not see that woman in person without receiving a gift and a handwritten note. But here's what's also cool is I know this because I get to coach Tracy.
Alex Judd:She, her high return habit is so she runs a a franchise organization. They have, I think, a 153 franchisees right now all across the country. And her high return habit is every day she writes a handwritten note of encouragement to a franchisee. Love that.
Ben Loy:Unbelievable. And that takes some intentional time to do.
Alex Judd:That takes some intentional Especially
Ben Loy:running a business, like, to take yeah. That love it.
Alex Judd:Dude, and and she just she's a machine. Yeah. Right? But then she's not a machine because it's like you get it and you're like, she actually saw. She actually noticed.
Alex Judd:Like, her heart is in this. And and, yeah. So I just admire Tracy so much in that regard. And and so, you know, when you think about a handwritten note, what is the power of it? Well, the power of it is it's so rare nowadays.
Alex Judd:The second thing is is it's like it's like these mini moments. Like, what do people get in the mail now? Ads and bills. Right? Like, that's what people get in the mail.
Alex Judd:Right? And so if you get a handwritten note in the mail, you're like, before you even open it, you're feeling good. And then you see whose name is on it and you're like, man, this is awesome. And then number three, it's something that you can keep with you, which is really, really critically important. So shout out to Tracy.
Alex Judd:She does such a wonderful job of that, and and her actions, I know, inspire other people to do the same.
Ben Loy:Yeah. This is less leadership based but more just on the on the, I think, the power of, like, handwritten letters and notes. When I was in, when I was in boot camp, a, my my parents sent a letter every single day and we didn't even get mail every single day. And so I was getting, like well, on the days we did get mail, I was getting, like, multiple letters from them and, like, realized, like, oh, wow, like, my dad literally, like, bought sometimes it was, like, a Hallmark letter that was funny or whatever but, like, took the time every single day while I was in boot camp for eight weeks to like write a letter, put it put a stamp on it, put it in the mail, and was like thinking of me. And so that was awesome and I kept many of them.
Ben Loy:But in that same thought, like a group of friends that I lived with in Tucson, some of my closest friends, collectively wrote a bunch of letters and stuck it in one envelope and sent it to me as just, like, encouragement while I was there. And, yeah, like, kept them. Like, still have them. They're in a box. I like every every time I move or, like, I'm cleaning things out, I come across them and I sit down and I lose about, like, an hour of productivity because I'm just, like, reading through them and I'm and just remembering and, like, it's so anyway, it's it's an incredible tool to use.
Alex Judd:It's something that we do, before our in person experiences and we've done it since year one is we write everyone that's attending a handwritten letter and our team does that. And that was much easier whenever we had 13 people showing up to our experience. Now we have 60 people showing up to our experience, and it's like, we still do it. And why do we still do it? Well, there's many reasons, but one of the reasons is is, like, we are requesting of people to give themselves at this experience.
Alex Judd:Like, we are asking of them to pour themselves into it. So like we already said, we should probably go first. And so, like, we're gonna invest a little bit of our time, energy personally into them before they even have the opportunity to invest into this experience. Mhmm. And, yeah, so powerful.
Alex Judd:Like, so powerful. Do not forget the value of just handwriting a note. Yeah.
Ben Loy:It's a good number three.
Alex Judd:Yeah. The final thing I would say on number two too is, like, we're talked about it with your team a lot, but, like, I dare you leave a handwritten note for your spouse, like, in the next week. Good things seem to happen when you do that. Just saying. Okay.
Alex Judd:Let's go to, number three. So make proactive phone calls. So there's a story behind this one, and I think I've shared on the podcast before. Olivia on our team, one of the things that I realized is, like, man, I I can't even remember how I realized this. But I I realized, if I'm not careful, we have a remote team.
Alex Judd:And the only time Olivia, who's our coaching manager, sees my name pop up on her phone spontaneously we have our regular one on one meetings. But what I was thinking about is, like, when she sees my name pop up on her phone spontaneously, it's one of two things. One is I I have a request to make of her. Number two is I have feedback to give her. And I was like, man, that's a that's, like, not a great way to experience my name popping up on your phone.
Alex Judd:And I don't wanna repeat that necessarily. And so I just made the decision, like, I'm going to start rewriting that narrative a little bit. And had remembered that she did a talk, not actually part of Path for Growth. She facilitated a panel at a women in business summit at her church. And, and I just made the point of watching that recording, and then I just gave her a spontaneous phone call.
Alex Judd:And I said, like, Olivia well, she answered the phone. She's like, hey, Alex. And I was like, she's expecting feedback or a request. And then, and then I just asked her. I said, Olivia, I've got a two minute version or a a thirty minute version.
Alex Judd:Which one do you want? And she said, well, I was just about to sit the boys down for lunch, and I need to make sure that, like, they're set and good to go. So can we do the two minute version now? And then if we need to, we can schedule a thirty minute one later. And I was like, yeah.
Alex Judd:That's totally fine. I said, I won't keep you for too long, but I just watched your recording from the panel that you facilitated, and I've got a whole list of amazing things that you did. You were so humorous. You were so intentional. You worked with the room that was given to you.
Alex Judd:You made sure that people had the opportunity to hear their voice heard. You got really, really practical in the content with people. You did such a good job, and I just wanna make sure you heard from me. Like, I am so grateful for your example. I'm so grateful for your leadership, and I'm really, really proud of the way, that you led on that panel.
Alex Judd:And she she, like, had tears in her eyes. Like, maybe we could do the thirty minute version. And and why was it so impactful? Well, because I hadn't done it in quite a while. Right?
Alex Judd:And it's so fun. It's so fun, especially if it's authentic to just blindside people by looking for opportunities to just call
Ben Loy:and
Alex Judd:say, all I've got for you is a word of encouragement. So I would just take time to do that, you know, and that can be for people on your team, that can be for people you lead with, that can be for people. Sometimes it's even harder to do with people that are family or close friends because a lot of times, I'm like, I need to have a reason to call, and that's not a reason. That can be a reason is what I need to remember.
Ben Loy:Yeah. I love that story.
Alex Judd:Yeah. I know I've told that story before.
Ben Loy:Yeah. We're running out of time, so I think we need to get through the next next four or so.
Alex Judd:But Okay.
Ben Loy:Number four is share public affirmations, which we do. We just got done doing at our experience. I know we just talked about this, but, share a little more on that.
Alex Judd:Yeah. I think of affirmations being different than shout outs and then shout outs are oftentimes here's what you did. Affirmations is, hey, I wanna call out and encourage something that you are.
Ben Loy:Mhmm.
Alex Judd:And so I really like to distinguish that. And creating space for you to share publicly, I think private affirmations are necessary and good, but I also think that there's a space for public affirmation. And you this is one where really, as a leader, like, take, you know, take the leap. Go first. Be willing to give a toast to someone or affirm someone or call out someone in your meeting and just say, I wanna public I wanna publicly affirm you for who you are, and here's the many ways that I've seen that play out.
Alex Judd:This is a uniquely powerful time to do that, and I just hope that leaders take advantage of that. And with that, I think it actually connects to number five, which is, to the degree that you can, don't just share those affirmations with the individual, share them with their spouses. You wanna see grown men become smitten. Like, affirm them, like, in front of, the woman that they love most and, like, watch their woman, like, nod their head and, like, like, just adore that. It's so it's so good.
Alex Judd:It's so cool. Because just think about the context. And this occurs both ways, right? Is the husband or wife goes to work, and they work really hard, and they care deeply. And then they come back, and they tell stories, hopefully, and share small details about what their day looked like.
Alex Judd:But if they're not a boastful and braggadocious human being, they're not coming back and saying, let me tell you about all the amazing things that I did today. And so their spouse oftentimes doesn't get to see, number one, all the great things that they're doing, but they also don't get to see how appreciated they are. And so getting creative, whether it's during an affirmation at a Christmas dinner that their spouse is at, maybe it's writing a handwritten note to their spouse, which I've seen leaders do before, but it's making sure their spouse hears about all all the great things that they're doing and the important person that they are for the organization is a powerful form of recognition.
Ben Loy:That goes into the next one which is to thank their spouse, right?
Alex Judd:Yes, exactly. So the next one is like, you know, we just talked about thanking them in front of their spouse or affirming them in front of their spouse. Sometimes you just need to shift your eyes entirely and say like, I want to thank you because if I'm experiencing any excellence in this person, I know that it's it's certainly not because they have a negative home environment. It's not because they have a neutral home environment. It's that because they have an excellent home environment.
Alex Judd:Mhmm. And you play a role in that. I have I have you know, this is what I want to tell the spouses on our team. I have never seen a person perform exceptionally well whose marriage was really, really tumultuous bad and they weren't feeling supported at home. And right now, our whole team is performing exceptionally well.
Alex Judd:So I could thank all of them, but I get to see them all the time. I want to spend this time to thank you. Mhmm. And, a lot of times, spouses are the unseen heroes behind the great work that your people do, and one of those people is your spouse. Right?
Alex Judd:Like, and so everything that we just said, like publicly affirming your spouse in front of the people that you lead, we just I mean, at the experience that we just had, we were doing affirmations. Right? I I did a move that I don't know if I should have done or not, but I gave all 60 people. I said, this is Aspen's phone number. I want you to know none of this would would have occurred if it weren't for her love, care, and support.
Alex Judd:And, like, we are getting better as a community because of her, and she wasn't able to be there that night because she was putting Lily to bed. And so I said, like, I I would just appreciate it if you would affirm her. Right? Get creative on this one to make sure the spouses feel, how much you value who they are and what they do.
Ben Loy:This last one, which is slow them down to receive it. I mean, just thought of Brian stopping Michelle and, like Yeah. Like, look into my eyes, right, like, hear what I am saying. Yeah. Can you share a little bit more on that before we close out?
Alex Judd:Yeah. Well, we know this because we feel it. Right? It it's hard it's hard to give affirmation because it feels vulnerable if it's wholehearted. Right?
Alex Judd:You're giving a piece of your heart. It's also hard to receive affirmation, genuine affirmation, because it feels vulnerable. And and so what do we do is we often deflect with self deprecation. Well, I wasn't that good or I'm not all that. Right?
Alex Judd:Or we deflect to the team, which is a good leadership practice. Well, there are a lot of people that were really, really involved. Or, you know, there's other strategies that we use to basically say that light is really bright and I don't want it on me. And I'm not even saying we shouldn't use strategies. But as a leader, notice when people are using those strategies and have the guts to say, hey, I I know that they're doing a great job.
Alex Judd:I know that you've got an amazing team, but this doesn't happen without your intentionality and without your effort. And then look them dead in the eye. Look them dead in the eye. And I just want you to know that I see you, and you're working so hard. You're doing such a good job with such character and and well done.
Alex Judd:It's doubling back, slowing them down to be able to receive. And what's crazy is I've seen this happen before. You say to them the first time, they deflect. You slow them down, look them in the eyes, say it a second time, and they get tears in their eyes. And now you know they've received it.
Alex Judd:And so you're leading by setting the pace in these conversations. And so set the pace well, slow people down, and and, you know, lead them in the receiving of affirmation in their heart, not just in their head.
Ben Loy:Yeah. Was there anything you wanted to say before we close out?
Alex Judd:Yeah. We already said, you know, Christmas is this wonderful time where in some ways people are primed to be able to do this, and you you also probably have team dinners or team meetings or team parties or stuff like that. That's a fun time to give gifts, and and that's a fun time to eat good food and drink good wine and all of that. And I think you should do all of that. The leadership part, of this season comes in what we're talking about here.
Alex Judd:And and not just giving a check, not just giving, not just giving a few pre primed words to everyone, but giving individual recognition and affirmation to specific people. And I would just tell you, the leaders that really maximize this season and service for other people are are gonna go first in that. They're gonna be vulnerable. They're gonna give their whole heart to it, and people are gonna benefit. And I believe in that God is going to be glorified.
Alex Judd:Mhmm. Thanks, Alex. Thanks, Ben. Well, there you have it. Thanks so much for joining us for this episode.
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Alex Judd:Hey. Thank you so much to the Path for Growth team, Kyle Cummings and the crew at PodCircle, and the remarkable leaders that are actively engaged in the Path for Growth community. Y'all are the people that make this podcast possible. Y'all know this. We're rooting for you.
Alex Judd:We're praying for you. We wanna see you win. Remember, my strength is not for me. Your strength is not for you. Our strength is for service.
Alex Judd:Let's go. Let's go. Let's go.